Cage Discussion

[MIOffroadCustoms]

I also need an address for an accurate estimate on shipping.

 

There will also be sales tax if you live in California just an heads up. 

[suicideking]

1 hour ago, MIOffroadCustoms said:

Not really much weight savings.  I will say a fast back looks WAY better imho. 

 

Probably fast back. I do prefer that look 

[Crawl2Camp]

1 hour ago, suicideking said:

 

Probably fast back. I do prefer that look 

The Suicide King getting more mods.  Nice.

[suicideking]

On 3/12/2023 at 12:14 PM, Jetlau3 said:

How much does Trailwize cage cost ? Assume Jim priced it out 

 

He responded: $3500 - $4000 which includes powder coating and installation. His waiting list is about 2 months. 

 

So that might be an option. I would have to borrow a trailer or stuff to flat tow. Might just buy the stuff to flat tow since I've been wanting to do that and don't have a place to store a trailer.

 

It would be a pain in the ass to get it up there and pick it up, but price sounds reasonable. 

[Jetlau3]

4 hours ago, suicideking said:

 

He responded: $3500 - $4000 which includes powder coating and installation. His waiting list is about 2 months. 

 

So that might be an option. I would have to borrow a trailer or stuff to flat tow. Might just buy the stuff to flat tow since I've been wanting to do that and don't have a place to store a trailer.

 

It would be a pain in the ass to get it up there and pick it up, but price sounds reasonable. 

That isn’t too bad at all with install.  Do you know how long he would need to keep the Jeep ? 

[Jdofmemi]

5 hours ago, suicideking said:

 

He responded: $3500 - $4000 which includes powder coating and installation. His waiting list is about 2 months. 

 

So that might be an option. I would have to borrow a trailer or stuff to flat tow. Might just buy the stuff to flat tow since I've been wanting to do that and don't have a place to store a trailer.

 

It would be a pain in the ass to get it up there and pick it up, but price sounds reasonable. 

FYI, for the next few months I'm working near San Jose. 

 

I would possibly be able to haul your Jeep up on a run for you. 

[suicideking]

2 hours ago, Jdofmemi said:

FYI, for the next few months I'm working near San Jose. 

 

I would possibly be able to haul your Jeep up on a run for you. 

 

That would be sick if that worked out! I'll see when he thinks his next opening would be. 

[Crawl2Camp]

15 hours ago, suicideking said:

 

He responded: $3500 - $4000 which includes powder coating and installation. His waiting list is about 2 months. 

 

So that might be an option. I would have to borrow a trailer or stuff to flat tow. Might just buy the stuff to flat tow since I've been wanting to do that and don't have a place to store a trailer.

 

It would be a pain in the ass to get it up there and pick it up, but price sounds reasonable. 

Wow, really good price.  I’d assume that the powder coating alone has to be around a grand if not more, from what I've paid for other things etc..
Were you ever able to talk to OC Cageworks?  

[suicideking]

6 hours ago, Crawl2Camp said:

Wow, really good price.  I’d assume that the powder coating alone has to be around a grand if not more, from what I've paid for other things etc..
Were you ever able to talk to OC Cageworks?  

 

I emailed them and sent a message on IG. No response yet. So far Trailwize is the most responsive which I think is important. I also got a quote for parts from @MIOffroadCustoms. It seems nobody else wants my money. 

I haven't ruled out OC Cageworks yet. That would definitely be more convenient. 

[Crawl2Camp]

41 minutes ago, suicideking said:

 

I emailed them and sent a message on IG. No response yet. So far Trailwize is the most responsive which I think is important. I also got a quote for parts from @MIOffroadCustoms. It seems nobody else wants my money. 

I haven't ruled out OC Cageworks yet. That would definitely be more convenient. 

I was just talking to the guy from OC_Cageworks right now about a cage for my JKU. His prices are around 6K for a complete custom cage in my JKU, painted, b pillar chop and fully installed.  
FYI Most of these guys are easy to get ahold of right before they start in on the days work. (7-9am)

[suicideking]

18 hours ago, Jetlau3 said:

That isn’t too bad at all with install.  Do you know how long he would need to keep the Jeep ? 

 

He said 3-4 weeks. 

[suicideking]

56 minutes ago, Crawl2Camp said:

I was just talking to the guy from OC_Cageworks right now about a cage for my JKU. His prices are around 6K for a complete custom cage in my JKU, painted, b pillar chop and fully installed.  
FYI Most of these guys are easy to get ahold of right before they start in on the days work. (7-9am)

 

He just replied:

 

Quote

Good morning, looking at around 5.5k-6.5k depending on design and color.

Also depending on if you want to get the B pillar chop which allows you to remove the B Pillars in a matter of minutes right before a trail zo avoid hitting them and also giving you a more open view

 

So Trailwize is the better price by $1500 - $2000 or so. $6.5K still isn't that bad, but for that price might still be worth it to deal with dropping off and picking up 5.5 hours away. 

 

Still haven't gotten a real estimate for the Genright cage installed. Though looking like a custom cage is going to be less expensive (which I honestly find shocking). Plus I know Blaine has a few complaints about how the Genright cage is designed. I'll call him soon and see if he'll remind me why he doesn't like the Genright and get his input on a custom cage. 

[Crawl2Camp]

14 hours ago, suicideking said:

 

He just replied:

 

 

So Trailwize is the better price by $1500 - $2000 or so. $6.5K still isn't that bad, but for that price might still be worth it to deal with dropping off and picking up 5.5 hours away. 

 

Still haven't gotten a real estimate for the Genright cage installed. Though looking like a custom cage is going to be less expensive (which I honestly find shocking). Plus I know Blaine has a few complaints about how the Genright cage is designed. I'll call him soon and see if he'll remind me why he doesn't like the Genright and get his input on a custom cage. 

It’s definitely worth hauling up to Trailwize and back iMO.  

OH NO… You made the mistake of bringing up a cage to Blaine.
I did that the last time I saw him and I just loved how blunt and opinionated his reply was.      

[Jdofmemi]

5 hours ago, Crawl2Camp said:

OH NO… You made the mistake of bringing up a cage to Blaine.
I did that the last time I saw him and I just loved how blunt and opinionated his reply was.      

Can you share that part?

 

Sounds interesting. 

[suicideking]

I did end up calling Blaine yesterday to get his input on Trailwize vs. OC Cageworks vs. Genright. His main point was that he doesn't like angle iron up front because he doesn't think it will hold up in a roll or in a car accident on the freeway. Feels that is the weakest area of the cage and it's less than a foot from you. He advised asking them if they have an option to have no angle iron and have tube that goes behind the dash. Otherwise, I should pass.

 

So I messaged Trailwize and OC Cageworks:
 

 

OC Cageworks: I can use either or..if I use tube I have to go down through the floor and to the body..or angle down to the pinhead by the door.

 

Trailwize: Uses Barnes stanchions (angle iron). 

 

Sent that to Blaine. His response was to pass on both. 

 

I do see his point if the angle iron isn't going to hold up. Though makes it a bit hard to find a cage since so far that's how all of them do it. 

 

Probably fine in most situations, but one of his points is you can't predict how you're going to roll or crash on the freeway. So it does have me thinking. 

 

Additional discuss with Blaine was that if you're going to have a cage and use the harnesses, they should be tight to where you shouldn't be able to lean out the door to look at your tires. Otherwise, they're not tight enough to prevent you from getting injured in a roll. Also that a helmet should be worn at all times and most don't wear one. 

 

Last point he brought up is to not let any of them remove the stock B pillar behind the seats. Says that's already stronger than any cage would be. 

[fiend]

43 minutes ago, suicideking said:

 

Additional discuss with Blaine was that if you're going to have a cage and use the harnesses, they should be tight to where you shouldn't be able to lean out the door to look at your tires. Otherwise, they're not tight enough to prevent you from getting injured in a roll. Also that a helmet should be worn at all times and most don't wear one. 

I definitely would be concerned about a head injury without a snug five point. But for me, driving around with that would be a nonstarter.  I have no shame in admitting that I’m not going to be doing crazy stuff that would warrant such measures.  If I were doing that, I’d just get a buggy. 

[suicideking]

10 minutes ago, fiend said:

I definitely would be concerned about a head injury without a snug five point. But for me, driving around with that would be a nonstarter.  I have no shame in admitting that I’m noting going to be doing crazy stuff that would warrant such measures.  If I were doing that, I’d just get a buggy. 

 

That's one of his arguments: If you're not going to wear a helmet, then don't get a cage. Even if you don't flop or roll, you can do something that will bash your head against the bars. You can choose to not do high risk obstacles that would warrant needing a cage. Then you're keeping your rig lighter which will no doubt make it handle better. 

 

One minor injury from a cage that I witnessed at Calico: A group ahead of us were towing a Land Rover that wouldn't start. It got disconnected from the tow rope somehow and T-boned a parked JKU. This made the passenger  in the JKU hit the side of her head pretty good on the cage giving her (drivers wife) a minor concussion. So the cage in this situation caused an injury that wouldn't have happened if there was no aftermarket cage. 

[Crawl2Camp]

All good points noted here.  
Sorry guys, been a little busy the last few days.  I thought I replied here quickly via phone, but just realized I sent a message/reply to Rick.  Yeah Blain made some very good points when we were talking about cages together last time I saw him.  (As Rick stated above) I respect what he has to say and his points of view.  This is kind of how his conversations go if you don't know him. (It obviously goes on much longer and in more depth than this.)


Q: What are you using the Jeep for?  
A: Rock crawling.
Q:Why do you think you need a cage?
A: More Safety
Q:Why do you think it’s more safe?  
A: Isn’t it?
Q: You tell me, your the one who says you need it.
A: Is that even a question?  
Q: What are you afraid of happening that would cause you to need one? 
A: Getting crushed?
Q: Do wranglers usually crush people when they flop?
A: No, just windshield frame damage etc.?
Q: So that isn't sufficient? 
A: Well it seems to be? 
Q: Stop making stupid decisions based off of social media and let me make you feel stupid and show you the way!
A:  Blain, thanks for expressing your feeling on cages and btw MTR’s suck and aren’t the best tires anymore.  

 

[fiend]

 I’ve never met this dude but I feel like I know him from this “conversation.”  

[Jdofmemi]

I will add some personal experience, though it came back in my Toyota days. 

 

I rolled my Toyota two times. 

 

Once early in it's life, spinning donuts in mud. Tires sank in and flipped me to the roof. 

I had a bed mounted "Roll Bar" and a bumper with a hoop. 

 

The cab crushed in a straight line from one to the other. The hoop was less than hood high, so the hood and front core support was smashed. The A pillars bent in and the roof nearly met the windshield in the front. The back of the cab was wrinkled, but not crushed. 

It probably wouldn't have been crushed without the "Roll Bar", but we will not know. 

 

The truck was basically totalled, though I was able to drive it a short distance after jacking the roof back up with...... my trusty Hi Lift jack. That was also how I self recovered from the roll too. 

 

After the frame up rebuild, I ditched the "Roll Bar" for a Smittybuilt in cab cage, with padding. 

 

Many years later, I had another rollover, at the play area at Truckhaven during TDS. 

I sent it hard up a ledge, and didn't make it. Backing down, I slipped off the passenger side. I rolled side, roof, other side. This was a significantly harder rollover than the first one. 

 

Because I had the cage, the roof did not crush, and because the roof didn't crush, the hood and core support were not crushed either. The windshield got a small crack, but did not shatter like before. 

 

The sum of damage from this more violent toll was a broken mirror, a crack in the windshield, and a few new dents in an already dented truck. We restarted it, and continued the run, and drove it home.

Because of the padded bars in the passenger area, I did not suffer any head injury. 

 

 

I shared this to reinforce my view that a cage is to keep the vehicle in useable condition after a mishap. 

 

Without a cage, I was not injured, but the truck was destroyed. With one, I was also not injured, and was able to drive off with minimal damage. 

 

My cages will likely get padded in the areas likely to be struck by my or my passengers head, and I will have a helmet for high risk scenarios. 

 

Is that a guarantee that nothing bad will happen? 

Absolutely NOT, but I feel I would rather not be stranded with a smashed rig somewhere out in the wild. A crushed, undrivable Jeep, far from a road, would be a huge problem. 

 

Take that for what you will, it's my opinion on the subject. 

[Jdofmemi]

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Co3cHSqpLrg/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

 

Another for the cage discussion. I know, it's not a Jeep, but..... 

 

[Gruff]

I hear what Blain is saying and for the average guys out there doing weekend stuff I think a cage is not necessary. I'm certainly no badass, HOWEVER, with the stuff we find ourselves doing now, which is one step below and sometmes the same as buggy lines, cages are a definite plus. I respect his opinion, but having a full cage makes me much more confident that I'm not going to get crushed doing the dumb shit we do.  

[fiend]

2 hours ago, Jdofmemi said:

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Co3cHSqpLrg/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

 

Another for the cage discussion. I know, it's not a Jeep, but..... 

 

Obviously, those lads did not have a high lift handy.  But hey, it's still drivable.

 

[suicideking]

On 3/17/2023 at 8:49 AM, fiend said:

I definitely would be concerned about a head injury without a snug five point. But for me, driving around with that would be a nonstarter.  I have no shame in admitting that I’m not going to be doing crazy stuff that would warrant such measures.  If I were doing that, I’d just get a buggy. 

 

After doing some reading, many suggest that if you're going to have a cage, that you wear a helmet 100% of the time. Realistically, I don't think that would happen, so I'm hesitant. 

 

One of the reasons I was thinking about getting a cage is because I want suspension seats with the harnesses. So one option could be to get the seats and then the bars in back of them to attach the harness. At least then I would be kept in place in a roll and not ejected since the oem seatbelts might not stop you. 

 

On 3/18/2023 at 11:08 AM, Jdofmemi said:

I will add some personal experience, though it came back in my Toyota days. 

 

I rolled my Toyota two times. 

 

Once early in it's life, spinning donuts in mud. Tires sank in and flipped me to the roof. 

I had a bed mounted "Roll Bar" and a bumper with a hoop. 

 

The cab crushed in a straight line from one to the other. The hoop was less than hood high, so the hood and front core support was smashed. The A pillars bent in and the roof nearly met the windshield in the front. The back of the cab was wrinkled, but not crushed. 

It probably wouldn't have been crushed without the "Roll Bar", but we will not know. 

 

The truck was basically totalled, though I was able to drive it a short distance after jacking the roof back up with...... my trusty Hi Lift jack. That was also how I self recovered from the roll too. 

 

After the frame up rebuild, I ditched the "Roll Bar" for a Smittybuilt in cab cage, with padding. 

 

Many years later, I had another rollover, at the play area at Truckhaven during TDS. 

I sent it hard up a ledge, and didn't make it. Backing down, I slipped off the passenger side. I rolled side, roof, other side. This was a significantly harder rollover than the first one. 

 

Because I had the cage, the roof did not crush, and because the roof didn't crush, the hood and core support were not crushed either. The windshield got a small crack, but did not shatter like before. 

 

The sum of damage from this more violent toll was a broken mirror, a crack in the windshield, and a few new dents in an already dented truck. We restarted it, and continued the run, and drove it home.

Because of the padded bars in the passenger area, I did not suffer any head injury. 

 

 

I shared this to reinforce my view that a cage is to keep the vehicle in useable condition after a mishap. 

 

Without a cage, I was not injured, but the truck was destroyed. With one, I was also not injured, and was able to drive off with minimal damage. 

 

My cages will likely get padded in the areas likely to be struck by my or my passengers head, and I will have a helmet for high risk scenarios. 

 

Is that a guarantee that nothing bad will happen? 

Absolutely NOT, but I feel I would rather not be stranded with a smashed rig somewhere out in the wild. A crushed, undrivable Jeep, far from a road, would be a huge problem. 

 

Take that for what you will, it's my opinion on the subject. 

 

If I do get a cage, I would probably do something similar: have the helmet for high risk stuff, but not wear it all the time.

 

I'm not really concerned about getting stranded because I figure there will always be a group with me. Recovering a totaled vehicle in the middle of nowhere would definitely be a pain though. 

[MIOffroadCustoms]

Safety over everything, nothing worse then standing over your mangled friend wondering how to get them to safety. With the wheeling we get into a stock cage is only going to do so much. I much rather know that the passenger compartment will retain its shape/space when an accident happens. Because it will happen eventually it’s just a matter of when.
 

IMHO It’s dumb to try to talk someone outta getting a cage. I will not ride in a rig without one, helmet or not. (I always have one strapped to my cage)

 

https://axeloffroad.com/